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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 07:33 pm
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George Durbin
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I have this fort wayne 8" fan. It appears to be blued over brass and is missing cage. Any one have a cage? I want to know age and any other particulars on this unit. No pics of this fan in the gallery...

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fort wayne fan 001 (640x458).jpg

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 07:34 pm
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George Durbin
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no 2

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fort wayne fan 002 (427x640).jpg

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 07:35 pm
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George Durbin
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no 3

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fort wayne fan 004 (640x458).jpg

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 07:36 pm
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George Durbin
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no 4

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fort wayne fan 003 (427x640).jpg

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 07:37 pm
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George Durbin
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this fan I think is sexy! ANY info would be appreciated...

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 08:32 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Well, it's not anything like what I usually see in an 8" Fort Wayne where the fans have a single bearing. But, being 25 cycles, your fan has a commutator so that may be why it's different and with a back bearing. I have never seen one like it.

Maybe yours is later than the one in the gallery that is all polished and of the single bearing variety.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 09:02 pm
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Michael Rathberger
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Steve Stephens wrote: Well, it's not anything like what I usually see in an 8" Fort Wayne where the fans have a single bearing. But, being 25 cycles, your fan has a commutator so that may be why it's different and with a back bearing. I have never seen one like it.

Maybe yours is later than the one in the gallery that is all polished and of the single bearing variety.

I have an 8"  GE DC with a very similar back motor housing, but George's appears to have an all brass base and front part of the motor housing. I know for certain mine is steel base and front motor housing.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 09:08 pm
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George Durbin
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After further review. I tried the magnet and it does NOT stick to the base or the rear or front cover... It does stick the the dividing ring between the covers...

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 09:31 pm
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Doug Handley
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George Durbin wrote: ... It does stick the the dividing ring between the covers...
It is probably sticking to the stator laminations right under the housing.  I'm thinking that you have yourself an uncommon fan there.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 10:01 pm
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Russ Huber
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Psssssssst.......which direction does a Fort Wayne blade spin?

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 10:05 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Russ Huber wrote:
Psssssssst.......which direction does a Fort Wayne blade spin?
Around and around but CW or CCW depending upon the model if I can believe what I see in the gallery.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 10:59 pm
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Nicholas Denney
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Doug Handley wrote:
It is probably sticking to the stator laminations right under the housing.  I'm thinking that you have yourself an uncommon fan there.

Yes, his fan is all brass. The motor housing is only two pieces, so if each end is brass, it must all be brass.

The fan here is a DC version of the all-brass in the gallery, so I would say it is possible that the blade correctly spins CW.

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 Posted: Thu Jan 17th, 2013 11:01 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Note how different the motor tags are between George's and the one in the gallery. Must be different time periods.

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 12:25 am
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Russ Huber
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The only image I can find. If you check out Mike Sturgeons example in the gallery, his fan has 3 wings against 1 in favor of CCW. I think Ralph's example is a GE BMY badged for FW. To weird.

Attached Image (viewed 729 times):

FortW8.jpg

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 12:35 am
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Doug Handley
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Nicholas Denney wrote:

The fan here is a DC version of the all-brass in the gallery, so I would say it is possible that the blade correctly spins CW.

However, the tag clearly states alternating current!  It appears to be a 25 cycle alt. current motor.

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 01:42 am
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Michael Rathberger
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GE Back, looks about the same. I don't think the FW back is brass, the vent holes look too thick...

Attached Image (viewed 753 times):

ge1.jpg

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 01:43 am
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Michael Rathberger
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GE Side, again looks similar. Also, blade is the same...

Attached Image (viewed 754 times):

ge2.jpg

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 01:43 am
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George Durbin
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Might be tough to date?
I think since it is 25 cycles it can be run on 60 cycles?
What do you think the cage should look like?
Need any more pics for any reason? I want to learn what I can from you guys in the brain trust...

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 Posted: Fri Jan 18th, 2013 06:38 am
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Nicholas Denney
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Doug Handley wrote:

However, the tag clearly states alternating current!  It appears to be a 25 cycle alt. current motor.


Sorry! DC on the brain...

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 02:15 am
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Austin B Ko
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George Durbin wrote: Might be tough to date?
I think since it is 25 cycles it can be run on 60 cycles?
What do you think the cage should look like?
Need any more pics for any reason? I want to learn what I can from you guys in the brain trust...
It will run on 60 cycles but very poorly and will over heat the motor, potentially ruining the motor. There might be a method you can use to run it safely but don't run it on 60 cycles. 

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 02:46 am
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George Durbin
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Thnx for the info. I dont want to ruin it and this one I am not interested in restoring. Im gonna e-bay or sell it to an AFCA member.

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 01:13 pm
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Stefan Osdene
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I have the original cage to this fan. This is one of the only all brass models I am missing from my collection. I would be willing to offer you $400 on it as it stands.

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 06:27 pm
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Loren Haroldson
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1. I notice Russ' woodcut has 4 S wires...instead of 6

2. 12 FT Wayne parts catalogue seems to indicate the Wood System on the badge is only on the 8 inch stationary.  8 inch oscillator and all 12 and 16s are like Bliss'es.

3. replacement blades for 8 inch are clockwise.(straight part is on left) 12 and 16 incher  counter clockwise. (straight part is on the right) including the 6 winger.

Motors are carried finished in black oxide with fan, guard and trimmings in lacquered brass. Oxidized copper, polished copper, polished or brush brass can be supplied at an additional cost.

In 8 inch the 25  cycle was a quarter more than 40 cycle 50 cents more than 50 cycle.l

I don't see a rear housing like this one in 12 catalogue. I might check 12 GE catalogue and compare.  imagine most of its the same?

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 06:33 pm
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Nicholas Denney
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Loren Haroldson wrote:

In 8 inch the 25  cycle was a quarter more than 40 cycle 50 cents more than 50 cycle.


Lower frequency needs more motor "mass", until you get to DC or universal motors. 400Hz AC is a standard used in aircraft because the motors can be made very light for the same mechanical output as a 60 cycle or even 133 cycle.

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 06:50 pm
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Loren Haroldson
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A couple more things. 12 FT Wayne and 12 GE of not only the same fans, but the same catalogue numbers?? So I guess it mattered where you placed your order, how else could you keep it straight.

Though GE dug them out of the garbage pile in 99, the name of Fort Wayne Electrical Works (of GE) did not appear until 1911. You can see evidence on the tags of the FT Wayne's in the gallery. Terry and Darryl's are older as is apparently George's fan... no GE mention on tag so 11 or before...Maybe I should go back out and check 10,11 or so GE catalogues? Why not?   back in a bit...I'm getting dragged back into this..

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 Posted: Sat Jan 19th, 2013 07:17 pm
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Loren Haroldson
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April 09 FT Wayne ad for 8 inch shows pizza slice blades..Were these off the croquet ball dragon fan?  I don't think Ge ever used pizza slice blades..NOTE THIS IS NON OSCILLATOR..

I don't see 8 inch GE fans for 08 or 09. I can't find 10 or maybe don't have. GE has 8 inch in 11. 

 

No guarantee whatsoever but since Ft 09 has pizza blades and.. it appears GE didn't have an 8 inch till 11 or maybe 10...  your fan could date 10 or probably early in 11 before the tag would have changed to read OF GE? I think that would put your fan in a very small window.  There are GE experts that can give you more accurate info than I can..It was just kind of fun to go out to the playhouse and dig around like a rat through paper again...Not tomorrow though....30 below wind chills coming.........

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:04 am
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Russ Huber
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Since tomorrow is deep freeze, I'll also do deeper digging. My knowledge of Fort Wayne stuff is lame. I bet Fort Wayne tags got slapped on GE junk. Just that simple.

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:13 am
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Nicholas Denney
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Seems like many had their hands in GE's pie in the early 20th... just as was the situation with pretty much every other company at the time. Someone was giving assemblies to someone else, swapping parts, swapping badges...

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 12:58 pm
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Russ Huber
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GE offered the 8" desk and bracket for its first season in 10. ONLY 4 wing models in AC or DC stationary in 10 for GE.

CHECK OUT Fort Wayne offered the 8"(CCW with rounded end blade) not only in 4 wing......but 6 wing AC or DC. Anyone have an 8" 6 wing FW in their collection?

Being both GE and FW 8" desk and bracket are shown together on one page, tells me George's example here is from the teens?

Attached Image (viewed 652 times):

FWGE11.jpg

Last edited on Sun Jan 20th, 2013 12:59 pm by Russ Huber

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:04 pm
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Russ Huber
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1910 GE fan motor bulletin. No 8" models in the 09 Bulletin.

http://books.google.com/books?id=vIjmAAAAMAAJ&pg=PT6&lpg=PT6&dq=FAn+motors+for+residences+and+telephone+booths++1910&source=bl&ots=nm5J2irFjd&sig=gEZHj9oVhYpFrqwjYXeHLTJrdto&hl=en&sa=X&ei=FPn7UPWCPYqj2QWC9YGwCw&ved=0CDMQ6AEwAA

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:21 pm
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Russ Huber
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1912 GE fan motor bulletin.

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GE12.jpg

Last edited on Sun Jan 20th, 2013 02:12 pm by Russ Huber

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:26 pm
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Loren Haroldson
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Then perhaps they sold so few 25 cycle fans, they slapped on old leftover tags minus the GE part? Sturgeon's fan shows they did put GE on their tags starting in 11 when the name was officially changed...

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:28 pm
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Russ Huber
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1913 GE fan motors.

Attached Image (viewed 581 times):

GE13.png

Last edited on Sun Jan 20th, 2013 02:11 pm by Russ Huber

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:42 pm
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Russ Huber
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Loren Haroldson wrote:
Then perhaps they sold so few 25 cycle fans, they slapped on old leftover tags minus the GE part? Sturgeon's fan shows they did put GE on their tags starting in 11 when the name was officially changed...

The 25 cycle fan motors would have brushes. I think it was Todd Mann in past that posted a 60 cycle AC GE 8" all brass brushed fan motor? If so, when did GE/FW start marketing AC brushed all brass fan motors?

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:54 pm
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George Durbin
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Wow! This is what I like about fan collecting. The history of why they did what they did. The espionage, jealousy's, idustry patents, trading back and forth the talent between companies, its all very cool... OMG!! A reality show is in order here. :cool: It would be way better than Ice Road Truckers fer sure! :clap:

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:55 pm
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Russ Huber
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Found the post. The tag looks like it was modified. This one would be and early bird.

http://www.afcaforum.com/view_topic.php?id=18535&forum_id=1&highlight=Todd+brass+GE

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IMAG0240-1-1 (1).jpg

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:55 pm
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Russ Huber
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.

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:56 pm
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Russ Huber
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.

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 01:59 pm
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Russ Huber
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Todd's example must of been a DC modified for AC at one time?

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 Posted: Sun Jan 20th, 2013 02:05 pm
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Russ Huber
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Holy buckets...I started reading Todd's post again...he states steel motor and base.

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