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How Are Brass Cages Made?  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 03:12 pm
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Richard Daugird
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Or steel for that matter. I was looking at the 16" Pancake cage Ted made me, and it is amazing that someone could do that by hand. The round front ring with the dips for the        S wires to wrap around, the S wires themselves, shaped and wrapped around the front ring, all lining up perfectly in the pierced rear ring. I don't aspire to make one myself, but I am very curious how it is done. Special tools, jigs, etc., anyone care to share some pictures?

Last edited on Wed Mar 7th, 2018 03:14 pm by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 03:45 pm
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Michael Rathberger
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http://www.afcaforum.com/view_topic.php?id=24175&forum_id=1&highlight=trojan+cage+made

 

http://www.afcaforum.com/view_topic.php?id=28999&forum_id=1&highlight=trojan+cage+made

 

 

Admired both of these posts when I saw them...

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 03:53 pm
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Steve Stephens
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GE must have looked at how Paul and Dan made cages and came up with a more complicated but faster way.
https://books.google.com/books?id=6n9NAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA741&dq=The+brass+wire+is+first+cut+into+lengths+which+are+long+enough&hl=en&sa=X&ei=6N9_UdSVNqa42AXV8oHoDQ&sqi=2&ved=0CDkQ6AEwAA#v=onepage&q=The%20brass%20wire%20is%20first%20cut%20into%20lengths%20which%20are%20long%20enough&f=false

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 04:00 pm
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Richard Daugird
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Great info, guys!!! Thanks!

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 04:02 pm
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Steve Stephens
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More:
http://www.afcaforum.com/forum1/30914.html

http://www.afcaforum.com/forum1/32226.html


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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 05:59 pm
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William Dunlap
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I wish I could get my hands on that heavy equipment for making cages.  :cry:I have to make all mine piece by piece by hand.
And I've made a few tools and bought some that make the job a bit easier.

But there's a lot more to making a cage than just bending wires.

Just selecting and finding the best material to make them with can be a challenge. McMaster Carr is great and they have 6 foot lengths that are necessary for making rings from one piece instead of welding pieces together, but they don't carry all the sizes in hard brass I like to use for rings.

Annealing brass to make bends and rings makes for a squishy, weak cage. Sometimes that has to be done as the material is not available. (I'm still looking for any vendor that supplies .100 diameter rod in any lengths or any type of brass)

260 brass is half hard but will do full circle bends without breaking. Good luck with 360 brass. It snaps right at about 90 degrees using .125 diameter so it needs to be annealed which renders it softer than 260.

The best cage is made from 360 brass rings with 260 brass spokes, in my opinion. Good luck finding material that allows you to make all the parts in this manner.

Making the front rings with the "v" notch in them works better with a sort of "u" shaped notch, with the floor of the "V" flat to seat the spoke. Spokes stay better aligned that way. 

Whacking spokes with a hammer to tighten them is strictly a no-no in my operation. I have special tools and techniques for that.

Then there's the math. I use a lot of Pi. I'm almost to the point where I can do the math in my head....

I pride myself on my welds, ie, Westy cages. I like to make them very hard to find...

And on and on. Don't want to give away all the secrets. 

Cheers,
Bill








Last edited on Wed Mar 7th, 2018 06:00 pm by William Dunlap

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 08:22 pm
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Richard Daugird
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Yeah, it  LOOKS easy...

Last edited on Wed Mar 7th, 2018 08:23 pm by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 08:25 pm
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Richard Daugird
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Makes me wonder where all that tooling disappeared to from way back when.

Last edited on Wed Mar 7th, 2018 09:15 pm by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 10:21 pm
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William Dunlap
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Probably scrapped.....sadly.

Next cage I make, I'll do a pictorial.
To include welding, rolling, crimping, spoke wrapping, soldering, cleaning, polishing, cleaning again, clear lacquering, packing and shipping.
A lot of work has gone into packing and shipping, using feedback I've had from members here. I think I have that one down pat.


Cheers,
Bill

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 Posted: Wed Mar 7th, 2018 11:59 pm
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Russ Huber
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.



Attached Image (viewed 414 times):

3.jpg

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 Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2018 12:29 am
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Russ Huber
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Child labor building Lundell guards at IC in 95.

Attached Image (viewed 405 times):

IC95.jpeg.jpg

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 Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2018 06:44 am
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Richard Daugird
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That. Would. Be. AWESOME!!!

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 Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2018 06:45 am
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Richard Daugird
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William Dunlap wrote: Probably scrapped.....sadly.

Next cage I make, I'll do a pictorial.
To include welding, rolling, crimping, spoke wrapping, soldering, cleaning, polishing, cleaning again, clear lacquering, packing and shipping.
A lot of work has gone into packing and shipping, using feedback I've had from members here. I think I have that one down pat.


Cheers,
Bill
That. Would. Be. AWESOME!!!

Last edited on Thu Mar 8th, 2018 06:46 am by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Thu Mar 8th, 2018 03:49 pm
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Greg Rodocker
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Richard - thanks for asking the question of " how to make cages". To all thanks for sharing.






Richard Daugird wrote:
Makes me wonder where all that tooling disappeared to from way back when.
My grandfather worked for Motor Wheel in Lansing, MI as a tool and die man. He primarily built test engine blocks and prototype parts. The milling and boring machines that he use were from the WWI era. When he retired in the 1960's the company scrapped the equipment because no one else knew how to run them. Plus I am sure they had much newer equipment. 

Greg

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 Posted: Fri Mar 9th, 2018 08:25 pm
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Richard Daugird
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This tool looks like the base came from a fan, see the rectangular slot on bottom for a switch-


Last edited on Fri Mar 9th, 2018 08:26 pm by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Fri Mar 9th, 2018 09:16 pm
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William Dunlap
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It certainly is a fan base. Very hand to use what falls to hand.
I can't quite make out what function this person is performing.
Seems to me the business part of it is in his right hand. 
He could be just making a simple loop for attaching to the center ring. It looks the the wrap is already done on the other end. After this function, it looks as though it would be ready to forum the "s" bends to make a finished spoke.

After looking at it again, it appears that two spokes are formed at the same time with wraps and loops formed first on both ends. That means he is forming the wrap and the end loop in this function
Hmm....there are several young lads in the neighborhood...maybe I can rope them into building some cages for me? Or not. That one kid looks really old for his age, doesn't he? Tough as nails, too, no doubt.

Cheers,
Bill

Last edited on Fri Mar 9th, 2018 09:19 pm by William Dunlap

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 Posted: Sat Mar 10th, 2018 12:02 am
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Richard Daugird
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I read the article, it explains it better than I can.
William Dunlap wrote:
I can't quite make out what function this person is performing.

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 Posted: Sat Mar 10th, 2018 01:07 am
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Russ Huber
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William Dunlap wrote: I can't quite make out what function this person is performing.


https://books.google.com/books?id=6n9NAAAAYAAJ&pg=PA741&dq=making+electric+fan+guards&hl=en&sa=X&ved=0ahUKEwj-osTS1eDZAhUSKawKHekqAb4Q6AEIKTAA#v=onepage&q=making%20electric%20fan%20guards&f=false

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 Posted: Sat Mar 10th, 2018 05:04 am
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William Dunlap
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Thanks, that's much more clear now.

Cheers,
Bill

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 Posted: Sat Mar 10th, 2018 06:46 am
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Richard Daugird
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Bill, if you really do a pictorial, it would be greatly appreciated. From what I've seen you are a master.

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 Posted: Mon Apr 2nd, 2018 07:52 pm
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Richard Daugird
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Bill did a really nice writeup of some of his process, link is in post below:

Last edited on Mon Apr 2nd, 2018 07:55 pm by Richard Daugird

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 Posted: Mon Apr 2nd, 2018 07:54 pm
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Richard Daugird
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http://www.afcaforum.com/forum1/50753.html

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