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GE Brass Bell  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2020 07:23 pm
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Dustin Meyer
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My customer brought three brass bell fans to restore. They all have the same Cat.# 75423. Form #’s are 
AD1, AB1, W1. The W1 has a different loop and oscillator design. Everything else seems identical. I believe the AD1 and AB1 are early 20’s but can’t find any info on the W1. 
All were repainted black but the original color looks like Hunter green maybe.







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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2020 07:46 pm
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Noah Britt
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http://www.fancollectors.org/info/mbr/geform.htm

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2020 08:16 pm
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Tom Morel
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Form W is 1921.

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 12:14 am
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Dustin Meyer
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One motor has 2 head wires, another has three, and the third has four head wires. Only two are needed so assume the multi head wire motors were used on other models. 

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 12:33 am
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Lane Shirey
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Very different motors. 2 wire is a shaded pole, 3 wire uses resistance in the choke windings to get the phase shift and the choke to control speed, and the 4 wire uses different windings in the stator to achieve the speeds with no speed coil at all. 

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 12:54 am
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Dustin Meyer
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All three motors are wired the same only using two leads to the switch.



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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 12:19 pm
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Lane Shirey
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You’d need to compare the stators. A previous owner or unknowing seller may have just shoved a random switch  in the base.  For example the 4 wire headwire should have no choke mounted to the switchplate.  

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 04:24 pm
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Dustin Meyer
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These three fans were completely unmolested, never been opened up. All three run on all three speeds. I removed the outer wrap on the head wires and found two unused on the 4 wire set up and one unused on the three wire set up. One head wire attaches to the ac post and one lead to the high switch speed post. The AB1 and AD1 coils are identical but the W1 coi on the left is a little different. I have run across the multiple head wires in the past with GE fans. 



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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 04:59 pm
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Levi Mevis
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Dustin Meyer wrote: These three fans were completely unmolested, never been opened up. All three run on all three speeds. I removed the outer wrap on the head wires and found two unused on the 4 wire set up and one unused on the three wire set up. One head wire attaches to the ac post and one lead to the high switch speed post. The AB1 and AD1 coils are identical but the W1 coi on the left is a little different. I have run across the multiple head wires in the past with GE fans. 



The odd one out speed coil looks like it was a later replacement as it looks like the style of speed coil you would find in a 1st Generation Vortalex.

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 05:11 pm
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Dustin Meyer
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These fans are completely unmolested, never been opened. I have restored a lot of fans and I know when a fan has been worked on in the past. All three had the original headwires. The W1 is a little older fan and it appears GE changed the coil for the later forms. Nothing has been swapped out. 

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 06:00 pm
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Levi Mevis
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Dustin Meyer wrote: These fans are completely unmolested, never been opened. I have restored a lot of fans and I know when a fan has been worked on in the past. All three had the original headwires. The W1 is a little older fan and it appears GE changed the coil for the later forms. Nothing has been swapped out. 
That's weird because I have a 1932 GE AOU and the Speed coil in it looks just like the ones that have the rounded speed coils. But I guess GE was known for making design changes that weren't always recorded.

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 07:17 pm
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Dustin Meyer
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Levi the W1 is a 1921 model and the AD and AB1’s are 1922. The newer coils are common to a lot of GE models, no need to redesign if something works. Your point about about undocumented changes is very true and it applies to just about everything. I am a retired engineer from a major airline and we would find design changes in a lot of our aircraft that were never included in the wiring diagrams or maintenance manuals. Caused all kinds of problems. These old fans were assembled by workers sitting at a bench with parts given to them. I’ve seen instances where if a certain part wasn’t available another similar part from a different model was used. 

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 Posted: Fri Oct 23rd, 2020 07:24 pm
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Levi Mevis
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Dustin Meyer wrote: Levi the W1 is a 1921 model and the AD and AB1’s are 1922. The newer coils are common to a lot of GE models, no need to redesign if something works. Your point about about undocumented changes is very true and it applies to just about everything. I am a retired engineer from a major airline and we would find design changes in a lot of our aircraft that were never included in the wiring diagrams or maintenance manuals. Caused all kinds of problems. These old fans were assembled by workers sitting at a bench with parts given to them. I’ve seen instances where if a certain part wasn’t available another similar part from a different model was used. Probably what happened with your odd ball out unit then, probably ran out of the rounded speed coils and just used a square shaped one for it. 🤔

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 Posted: Sat Oct 24th, 2020 01:16 am
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Dustin Meyer
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Ohms checked the three stators today and the two with multiple leads only had continuity in 2 wires. The 3rd and 4th leads had no continuity and not sure why they were there. Used test leads to hook the stator to the switch and everything works. I would like to know if the GE experts have an answer for the non functional headwires. 

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 Posted: Sat Oct 24th, 2020 01:22 am
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Levi Mevis
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I know that westinghouse on some of their fans used a three wire head wire regardless of whether the fan was a capacitor motor or not, for example I have a Westinghouse PowerAire that had a 3 Wire headwire that used all 3 of the headwire leads, but then I have a Westinghouse LivelyAire that also uses a 3 Wire Headwire but only used two of the 3 wire leads the third wire lead was cut off and tied off inside the insulation, I think the use of the multiple wire headwires was a money saving thing.

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 Posted: Sat Oct 24th, 2020 02:39 am
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Dustin Meyer
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Levi this is a completely useless bit of trivia but just for grins I added up the individual parts in one of my GE’s and I come up with 85 parts. 

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 Posted: Sat Oct 24th, 2020 12:54 pm
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Lane Shirey
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I’ve restored maybe 7 or 8 brass bells and star fans, and all that I’ve had apart have had the square laminate stacks. I can’t recall any having the rounded style. 

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 Posted: Sat Oct 24th, 2020 05:24 pm
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Dustin Meyer
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Lane I don’t keep very good records but I have restored at least a dozen of the old GE loop handle oscillators, some have been brass bells most just the pot metal cone. They were all older models in the 20’s. Here are a few pics from some of the fans and they all have the round coil. I have found the square coil in newer model fans and in several of the pedestal fans. 














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