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Heartbroke, my 17666 fan showed up in the mail with a broken base, need a new one.  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 06:39 pm
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Mike Lackey
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Here is a picture of the base

Attached Image (viewed 1091 times):

Base.jpg

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 06:45 pm
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Nicholas Denney
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How about a fix?

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 06:49 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Those bases are very susceptible to getting a big chunk broken from the base flange during shipping. Before having one of these fans shipped make sure the seller understands that no pressure should be able to be put on the flange which should be packed so the flange is almost floating in air. Sorry to hear about the break on a rare fan. That base looks to be (been) in super original condition.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:01 pm
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Mike Lackey
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yes it was that is why I'm so upset.
how would you even think about fixing it? It has pressure from the foot so it does not set entirely flat on a surface
Hence why it broke.
Can it be replaced? Does anyone have one?

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:04 pm
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Mike Lackey
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I would hate to send this fan back, it was not cheap

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:06 pm
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Nicholas Denney
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I would hate for you to abandon that base. The original paint is in excellent condition.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:16 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Mike, you should be able to get a significant refund on the fan due to the seller's inadequate packing. What I usually do in a case of breakage is to email the seller saying there is a problem and I want to talk to them on the phone to see what the best course of action would be. If you don't point fingers at the seller or accuse them of causing the problem you may be able to come to a mutually acceptable conclusion. Such a break might be worth about a 1/3 refund. Shipping heavy fans back and forth across the country is to nobody's advantage. You can use ebay's protection policy and get a full refund. If the seller wants the fan back they should pay shipping both ways since it was their error that caused the problem. Good luck.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:17 pm
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Mike Lackey
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It's broke. And yes I am hating life right now but am looking for a solution. New base if need be would be prefferable than a crack that I can't hide.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:19 pm
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Mike Lackey
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yea it's a sticky wicket. If anyone knows where I can get another base please let me know. I might then be able to negotiate a price discount for the price of a replacement base.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 07:41 pm
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Mike Lackey
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Nicholas how would anyone go about fixing a base like that?

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:12 pm
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Andrew Block
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I can't even tell where the break is.

I would do a thin coat of JB Weld on the edges of the break and carefully see to it that no JB WEld is showing on the top of the base. Then I would either put a larger blob of JB weld on the base and some sort of a "stabilizer", likely a carefully shaped piece of sheet steel, that spans the break by an inch or so on both sides. Unfortunately the integrity will never quite be the same but it will be close.

I just used the same method to revive a beautifully original Westinghouse Sidewinder whos seller packed the fan with some peanuts and it came to me with the bottom blade in 5 pieces.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:14 pm
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Mike Lackey
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The break is as seen here in this photo

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:15 pm
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Mike Lackey
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this is the break

Attached Image (viewed 1009 times):

IMG_0030.JPG

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:22 pm
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Steve Stephens
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Would this work?

Grind both sides of the BOTTOM of the break like you were V-notching prior to welding. Use JB weld to attach the broken off piece and fill the notch on the bottom with JB Weld.

If the JB Weld will be too thick in the break maybe some other substance or epoxy would be better. You want the break to be closed up the best it can be. With a repair instead of a replacement the base will better match the motor. If you are going to repaint you can make the base repair nearly perfect so it can't be detected. But why would you repaint such a nice original finish?

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:26 pm
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Darryl Hudson
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Mike,

Sorry to hear about the base. That's part of dealing with ebay sellers. A better way to acquire fans is at regional fan meets or from other AFCA members. The average antique dealer just does not know how to pack a fan, especially an Emerson since most of them can't figure out how to get the blade off.

As for your broken base. If you have the broken pieces and it broke off clean, it can be repaired fairly easily. If you are missing chuncks, it still might can be saved, only will require a little more time/effort to do so. So you have two options: repair or replace. Either can work, but not likely overnight. Sometimes it takes a little while to find a replacement base that's in same condition as the rest of your fan, but I assure you, one will come along. Or you might find one a little quicker that would have to be refinished. Same for the repair....there's several handy repairmen in the AFCA that can fix that base, and you'll never know it was broken. I could repair it for you, but I can't just drop what I'm doing and put it ahead of other work that's been here a while. I think you'll find that any body who is good at what they do will have a longer wait time, and you'll want to get this done right, so be patient, and don't make any decisions today. Talk to a few folks, preferably those who have been around for a while. Meantime, chalk it up as a lesson learned, although I know you can't pack the sellers fan for them, but try not to be upset about it. We can fix it. I would take photos of the broken base and the pieces and email to the seller and request a partial refund. Not sure how the seller may or may not want to work with you on this, but you can always contact the carrier (UPS, Fed Ex, who ever handled it) and see if they will help, and thirdly, contact ebay if the seller will not compensate. It is a pain in the butt for sure, but don't let it get you down. We'll get you back up and running again.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:31 pm
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Randy Rohr
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Mike,

I can braze that base for you good as new, but the heat will ruin the paint

Randy Rohr

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:33 pm
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Mike Lackey
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Those are words of encouragement! That is good to hear that all is not lost. I'll do the time and see if we can find a fix. When you say it can be fixed do you mean like you can't tell it was broken even from the bottom?

I will contact the ebay person to see what we can work out. I would really hate to send this back.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 09:40 pm
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Mike Lackey
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Randy you're in Clifton Va, I'm in Bluemont, Va, that might be an option?

thats only about an hr from me. I'll have to contact the seller first to see what they want to do but am looking into all ideas at the moment.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:00 pm
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Randy Rohr
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You could come over or it could be mailed. I do know how to pack! Yes, and repair so it looks right both top and bottom.

Last edited on Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:01 pm by Randy Rohr

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:02 pm
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Mike Lackey
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I can't say now that I have seen what can happen that I do :):badidea

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:12 pm
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Nicholas Denney
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Randy, don't you think it would be a good try with some JB Weld? A good application of it should be more than enough. Mike, your break is not that scary. Yes, it is over a foot, but there's a lot of 'glue area'. The only problem I can see would be sufficiently clamping it so that the JB doesn't leave the crack open.

Last edited on Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:18 pm by Nicholas Denney

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 10:47 pm
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Ralph Bliss
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Mike, accept Randy's help and have it brazed, and the issue is over. JB Weld is good stuff, but its not the best choice for this repair.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:01 pm
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Mike Lackey
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Thanks !! for all the help seems like we have a couple of alternatives. I'm currently working with the seller the details as to what they want to do.
After that then I'll have to make a decision.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:03 pm
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Steve Sherwood
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This type of problem never happens when you buy your fans at fan meets.:clap:I never buy on e-bay and I never have this type of problem.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:05 pm
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Mike Lackey
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I'll be looking forward to my first meet I guess :)

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:26 pm
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Randy Rohr
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I think this break requires the strength of a braze. You might set the fan down a little crooked one day and the epoxy would break. Remember there's a foot on the broken piece. Braze is stronger than cast iron.

Randy

Last edited on Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:44 pm by Randy Rohr

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:33 pm
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Steve Stephens
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I have probably bought over 100 fans on ebay in the past 12 years and have had almost no damage and no broken or cracked cast iron parts.

When buying on ebay you HAVE to communicate to the sellers about the fragility of cast iron and make sure they pack the fans as they need to be. That doesn't always work but it can't be just luck that has gotten me all those fans with very little damage- blade and cage damage when seller could not remove the blade and/or cage. Only one blade was not fixable but the cages were.

I always prefer to buy fans at meets or elsewhere in person but many good fans do not appear at meets that I can make and do appear on ebay. Ebay is a great place to buy but the buyer and seller have added responsibilities to make sure the fan gets to the owner intact. Ebay is also a good option for we who do not live where the old fan selection is as good as in other parts of the country.

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 Posted: Tue Apr 24th, 2012 11:55 pm
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Ron Powell
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I've bought a few fans on eBay and always asked and explained how to pack it. Some think they know better and some just don't care once they have your money. So, there's always a percentage that are NOT going to pack it properly no matter what you say and always a percentage that might get damaged. I've got stories to raise the hair on the back of your neck.

I agree with Randy about brazing it, if done correctly it'll be permanent and will never show once it's restored. Now if you want a replacement base because your a stickler for authenticity that's okay too but, you may have to wait to find one.
I cant see it cost too much to repair it and if by chance you find another, you can always replace it then. Just my 3 cents.

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:09 am
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Mike Lackey
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Randy can you send me an email and let me know how much it might cost to braze this so I can inform the seller?
Mike.Lackey@hp.com

Last edited on Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:10 am by Mike Lackey

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:30 am
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Kim Frank
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Randy brazed up the rear motor cover on a 1900 GE cake for me that someone overtightened. It was first class and a permanent repair. The only way anyone would be able to tell is by stripping the finish off. The area of repair is around the upper left brass acorn nut. The cast iron was broken in three pieces......

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100_8535.JPG

Last edited on Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:33 am by Kim Frank

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:43 am
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Austin B Ko
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Darryl Hudson wrote:  A better way to acquire fans is at regional fan meets or from other AFCA members. I 100% agree. I rarely use ebay unless I see a stunning BIN price. Buying locally, at meets, or from other members is the way to go.:up:

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 12:57 am
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Ralph Bliss
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This 1902 stick motor housing was brazed by Rick Hoener, you would not be able to find where, no matter how close you look.

Attached Image (viewed 959 times):

Copy of 02stick4.JPG

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:06 am
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Andrew Block
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I have no doubt that members here do a fantastic job of repairing broken cast iron, however I disagree going the brazing route strictly because that original japanning is BEAUTIFUL.

Another possible method of repair is to repair is using the no-heat JB Weld Stick method and then bold the unit to a wooden base with support from the good interior section of the fan. If the rest of the fan matches the base then it would clean up to look like new. If the repair breaks sometime in the future, THEN have it brazed. Nothing ventured, nothing gained.

That said, its not my fan, do what you want and enjoy it! :)

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:07 am
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Randy Rohr
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$10 for gas and brass. N/C for a hard luck guy like you!

On second thought, you could JB Weld it and braze it later if it broke.  Saves you from messing w. paint or body work?

Last edited on Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:39 pm by Randy Rohr

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:21 am
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Nicholas Denney
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That's what I'm going after Randy. If JB doesn't hold... hey, we tried. If you go ahead with the brazing, you'll inevitably sacrafice that great paint. If the finish was crap, I'd say go braze happy! :clap:

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:48 am
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Randy Rohr
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Nick, I agree.

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 01:58 am
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Greg Miller
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Ron Powell wrote: Just my 3 cents.Ah, inflation finally got to opinions... such a shame... :hammer:

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 02:20 am
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Mike Lackey
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I love it!
Options, Options, Options!
The base does have a few nicks in it and the top has a few rust marks so brazing would not kill me besides I bought a bead blaster so stripping the paint may not be that difficult and maybe I can get it to look like new. Original is nice as long as original is undamaged and is "Original". Not knowing to much about this Japan finish can someone tell me why that is so much better than new paints? Sorry I know that sounds like a stupid question but yea if I don't ask I won't find out. :bigfan:bow

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 02:50 am
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Ron Powell
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Greg Miller wrote: Ron Powell wrote: Just my 3 cents.Ah, inflation finally got to opinions... such a shame... :hammer:

Hey Greg, You don't think I do this just  because I'm a nice guy do ya?
How do ya think I'm gona pay for next years membership?

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 Posted: Wed Apr 25th, 2012 02:51 am
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Ron Powell
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Mike Lackey wrote: I love it!
Options, Options, Options!
The base does have a few nicks in it and the top has a few rust marks so brazing would not kill me besides I bought a bead blaster so stripping the paint may not be that difficult and maybe I can get it to look like new. Original is nice as long as original is undamaged and is "Original". Not knowing to much about this Japan finish can someone tell me why that is so much better than new paints? Sorry I know that sounds like a stupid question but yea if I don't ask I won't find out. :bigfan:bow

Well, Enough said! If mine had Nick's in it I get rid of it.

Last edited on Wed Apr 25th, 2012 03:30 am by Ron Powell

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